 |
|
 |
| Author |
Message |
External

Since: Nov 25, 2007 Posts: 29
|
(Msg. 1) Posted: Sun Nov 25, 2007 9:13 am
Post subject: The Irresponsible Generation Archived from groups: alt>education, others (more info?)
|
|
|
I noticed, years ago, that many of the United States problems can be
tied to a single generation. Society calls them the Baby Boomers, but
I call them The Irresponsible Generation.
This generation protested everything in the 60's and 70's, riding
around in vans and taking drugs, rather than getting involved in the
solutions of fixing any of the problems they were talking about.
Then, they had kids, which launched the hands-off parenting style that
taught that parents couldn't control their kids or cater to their
child's needs. They were told to let the kids cry, until they settled
themselves. They were told to not preach their values to their
children but to let their children make their own choices. They were
told to "chill out" and to not "have a cow" about a little smoking or
drinking or porn viewing by their children. The kids, they were told,
needed to use trial-error to figure out their own path, apart from
their parents' paths, which conveniently got them out of having to
actually DO anything to help raise their kids....just turn them over
to the schools and back away.
Then, we had the dual-employment families with two people working and
no one caring for the kids or family needs. Are we surprised that
divorce rates shot up, when two people struggled for control in the
family with no support system?
This was joined, soon, by the rise in budget deficits (by both
parties), credit card debts, and bankruptcy rates, as the
irresponsible generation found new ways to avoid consequences.
Now, we are being told that the younger generations are going to be
taxed to the limit to pay for the retirement of an irresponsible
generation that A> didn't privately save up for their retirement, B>
didn't prepare the Social Security system in advance for themselves,
and C> raided the Social Security trust fund to pay for pet, political
projects. I mean, seriously, what DID this generation DO to keep this
burden from their children, or...did they expect the children (that
they were not responsible for as youth) must suddenly be responsible
for them?
This is just talking about finances. One could look, just as easily,
to terrorist organizations, pollution, disease, the decline of
religious-based support systems (with no financial support) and more
for other examples of this SAME generation bearing the bulk of blame
for the problems of this world.
Kenneth Clifton
christiansuperhero.com >> Stay informed about: The Irresponsible Generation |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Nov 25, 2007 Posts: 29
|
(Msg. 2) Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2007 7:18 am
Post subject: Re: The Irresponsible Generation [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
|
|
|
On Nov 25, 2:31 pm, Bob LeChevalier <loj....RemoveThis@lojban.org> wrote:
> >I mean, seriously, what DID this generation DO to keep this
> >burden from their children,
>
> Elected Clinton, who managed to balance the budget.
Oh...then..we're saved and need not worry about fixing Social
Security...right? I didn't realize that electing Bill meant the taxes
of the youth would NOT go up to pay for their parent's retirement.
Good news.
Kenneth Clifton
christiansuperhero.com >> Stay informed about: The Irresponsible Generation |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Feb 20, 2004 Posts: 4008
|
(Msg. 3) Posted: Mon Nov 26, 2007 2:31 pm
Post subject: Re: The Irresponsible Generation [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: alt>education, others (more info?)
|
|
|
Wide Eyed in Wonder <writingken.TakeThisOut@yahoo.com> wrote:
>On Nov 25, 2:31 pm, Bob LeChevalier <loj....TakeThisOut@lojban.org> wrote:
>> >I mean, seriously, what DID this generation DO to keep this
>> >burden from their children,
>>
>> Elected Clinton, who managed to balance the budget.
>
>Oh...then..we're saved
I'm saved, but that is a religious question and has nothing to do with
Clinton or the budget.
Alas for the budget, that which Clinton fixed, the Republicans broke.
>and need not worry about fixing Social Security...right?
If we don't worry about it, the next generation will have to. We
improved things, but didn't solve the problem, and then the Bushman
managed to undo much of what had been done by Clinton.
>I didn't realize that electing Bill meant the taxes
>of the youth would NOT go up to pay for their parent's retirement.
Who said that taxes would not go up? They will go up in any case
because of demographics. But at least if we had managed keep the
budget balanced or even in surplus, the amount that taxes would have
to go up would be plausible.
lojbab >> Stay informed about: The Irresponsible Generation |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Nov 25, 2007 Posts: 29
|
(Msg. 4) Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2007 7:07 am
Post subject: Re: The Irresponsible Generation [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: alt>education, others (more info?)
|
|
|
On Nov 26, 1:31 pm, Bob LeChevalier <loj....TakeThisOut@lojban.org> wrote:
> Wide Eyed in Wonder <writing....TakeThisOut@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >On Nov 25, 2:31 pm, Bob LeChevalier <loj....TakeThisOut@lojban.org> wrote:
> >> >I mean, seriously, what DID this generation DO to keep this
> >> >burden from their children,
>
> >> Elected Clinton, who managed to balance the budget.
>
> >Oh...then..we're saved
>
> I'm saved, but that is a religious question and has nothing to do with
> Clinton or the budget.
>
> Alas for the budget, that which Clinton fixed, the Republicans broke.
>
> >and need not worry about fixing Social Security...right?
>
> If we don't worry about it, the next generation will have to. We
> improved things, but didn't solve the problem, and then the Bushman
> managed to undo much of what had been done by Clinton.
>
> >I didn't realize that electing Bill meant the taxes
> >of the youth would NOT go up to pay for their parent's retirement.
>
> Who said that taxes would not go up? They will go up in any case
> because of demographics. But at least if we had managed keep the
> budget balanced or even in surplus, the amount that taxes would have
> to go up would be plausible.
>
> lojbab
Bingo. Bingo. Bingo. Three for three. The Irresponsible generation
didn't fix the system, when they knew the problem was coming, didn't
save up for themselves, and is forcing THEIR CHILDREN to pay for their
irresponsibility.
Kenneth Clifton
christiansuperhero.com >> Stay informed about: The Irresponsible Generation |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Feb 20, 2004 Posts: 4008
|
(Msg. 5) Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2007 1:31 pm
Post subject: Re: The Irresponsible Generation [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: alt>education, others (more info?)
|
|
|
Wide Eyed in Wonder <writingken DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote:
>The Irresponsible generation
There is no such thing, except in your irresponsible mindlessness.
>didn't fix the system,
Who said the system needed to be "fixed". It just needs to be paid
for.
>when they knew the problem was coming, didn't save up for themselves,
That rests firmly on the tax cut mania of the Reagan administration.
Social security was designed to deal with the problem that most
individuals don't "save up for themselves", a problem that has been
true of most people in EVERY generation, but which becomes more severe
as average lifespans get longer.
>and is forcing THEIR CHILDREN to pay for their irresponsibility.
That again rests on Republican "tax cut and spend".
lojbab >> Stay informed about: The Irresponsible Generation |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Feb 20, 2004 Posts: 4008
|
(Msg. 6) Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2007 1:34 pm
Post subject: Re: The Irresponsible Generation [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
|
|
|
Wide Eyed in Wonder <writingken.RemoveThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>Are you kidding?
No.
> He (or you) confirmed it to be absolutely true. The
>irresponsible generation is retiring into a system they didn't fix
They didn't break it either.
>and requiring their children to bail them out with higher taxes (on all
>other generations but their own).
That the tax rate needs to be higher in order to maintain the
government services that "we the people" want is patently obvious to
anyone but a "tax cut and spend" Republican. The irresponsibility is
to cut taxes anyway. And the whole generation is not to be held
responsible for the idiocy of people like YOU.
lojbab >> Stay informed about: The Irresponsible Generation |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Nov 25, 2007 Posts: 29
|
(Msg. 7) Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2007 1:39 pm
Post subject: Re: The Irresponsible Generation [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: alt>education, others (more info?)
|
|
|
On Nov 28, 12:31 pm, Bob LeChevalier <loj... DeleteThis @lojban.org> wrote:
> Wide Eyed in Wonder <writing... DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >The Irresponsible generation
>
> There is no such thing, except in your irresponsible mindlessness.
>
> >didn't fix the system,
>
> Who said the system needed to be "fixed". It just needs to be paid
> for.
>
> >when they knew the problem was coming, didn't save up for themselves,
>
> That rests firmly on the tax cut mania of the Reagan administration.
>
> Social security was designed to deal with the problem that most
> individuals don't "save up for themselves", a problem that has been
> true of most people in EVERY generation, but which becomes more severe
> as average lifespans get longer.
>
> >and is forcing THEIR CHILDREN to pay for their irresponsibility.
>
> That again rests on Republican "tax cut and spend".
>
> lojbab
ALL of that to confirm that the Irresponsible Generation (both
parties) KNEW this problem was coming and did nothing to fix it (not
even in the Clinton era, since Clinton...too...borrowed from the
Social Security trust fund).
Kenneth Clifton
christiansuperhero.com >> Stay informed about: The Irresponsible Generation |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Nov 25, 2007 Posts: 29
|
(Msg. 8) Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2007 1:43 pm
Post subject: Re: The Irresponsible Generation [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
|
|
|
On Nov 28, 12:34 pm, Bob LeChevalier <loj....RemoveThis@lojban.org> wrote:
> Wide Eyed in Wonder <writing....RemoveThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >Are you kidding?
>
> No.
>
> > He (or you) confirmed it to be absolutely true. The
> >irresponsible generation is retiring into a system they didn't fix
>
> They didn't break it either.
>
> >and requiring their children to bail them out with higher taxes (on all
> >other generations but their own).
>
> That the tax rate needs to be higher in order to maintain the
> government services that "we the people" want is patently obvious to
> anyone but a "tax cut and spend" Republican. The irresponsibility is
> to cut taxes anyway. And the whole generation is not to be held
> responsible for the idiocy of people like YOU.
>
> lojbab
The Social Security system was known to be deficient before Reagan
came to power, but that is irrelevant, since I said BOTH parties of
this generation failed their kids and neither did anything to fix it.
Further, since they knew it was coming, why didn't the Irresponsible
Generation save money up in a saving account or investments for their
expenses.
You can keep spinning this all you want, but..in the end...it used to
be that parents saved up an inheritance for their kids, while this
generation had sucked every other generation dry the whole way up
their life cycle and has NOTHING set aside for themselves or their
kids, now...except more debt for their kids.
Kenneth Clifton
christiansuperhero.com >> Stay informed about: The Irresponsible Generation |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Nov 25, 2007 Posts: 29
|
(Msg. 9) Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2007 1:58 pm
Post subject: Re: The Irresponsible Generation [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
|
|
|
On Nov 28, 3:49 pm, Bob LeChevalier <loj....RemoveThis@lojban.org> wrote:
> Wide Eyed in Wonder <writing....RemoveThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >ALL of that to confirm that the Irresponsible Generation (both
> >parties) KNEW this problem was coming and did nothing to fix it (not
> >even in the Clinton era, since Clinton...too...borrowed from the
> >Social Security trust fund).
>
> There is nothing wrong with borrowing from the trust fund, so long as
> we pay it back.
>
> lojbab
REALLY? KNOWing you don't have enough (already) in the trust fund and
taking more from it, anway, is not wrong? You, yourself, prove my
point, Bob.
Kenneth Clifton
christiansuperhero.com >> Stay informed about: The Irresponsible Generation |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Feb 20, 2004 Posts: 4008
|
(Msg. 10) Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2007 4:49 pm
Post subject: Re: The Irresponsible Generation [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: alt>education, others (more info?)
|
|
|
Wide Eyed in Wonder <writingken DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote:
>ALL of that to confirm that the Irresponsible Generation (both
>parties) KNEW this problem was coming and did nothing to fix it (not
>even in the Clinton era, since Clinton...too...borrowed from the
>Social Security trust fund).
There is nothing wrong with borrowing from the trust fund, so long as
we pay it back.
lojbab >> Stay informed about: The Irresponsible Generation |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Feb 20, 2004 Posts: 4008
|
(Msg. 11) Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:08 pm
Post subject: Re: The Irresponsible Generation [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
|
|
|
Wide Eyed in Wonder <writingken.DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>On Nov 28, 3:49 pm, Bob LeChevalier <loj....DeleteThis@lojban.org> wrote:
>> Wide Eyed in Wonder <writing....DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> >ALL of that to confirm that the Irresponsible Generation (both
>> >parties) KNEW this problem was coming and did nothing to fix it (not
>> >even in the Clinton era, since Clinton...too...borrowed from the
>> >Social Security trust fund).
>>
>> There is nothing wrong with borrowing from the trust fund, so long as
>> we pay it back.
>
>REALLY? KNOWing you don't have enough (already) in the trust fund and
>taking more from it, anway, is not wrong?
Your statement doesn't make any sense. The trust fund isn't a pile of
money somewhere. It is a paper (or more likely computerized)
accounting of how much the social security administration holds in
trust for the beneficiaries of social security.
Money held in trust is always invested somewhere, which means that
someone is "borrowing it". If that someone can be counted on to pay
it back before the trust fund needs to fulfill its obligations, then
the trust fund is properly working, and no one is "taking more from
it", or indeed "taking" anything.
It is when the government borrows money with no hope of paying it
back, and no sense of obligation to pay it back that this "trust" is
misplaced. But the social security administration doesn't have a lot
of choice - the only things it can be legally invested in are part of
the deficit financing.
>You, yourself, prove my point, Bob.
You have no point, turkey.
lojbab >> Stay informed about: The Irresponsible Generation |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Feb 20, 2004 Posts: 4008
|
(Msg. 12) Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:41 pm
Post subject: Re: The Irresponsible Generation [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
|
|
|
Wide Eyed in Wonder <writingken.TakeThisOut@yahoo.com> wrote:
>I recall Hillary touting abortion as a means to control the
>"population explosion"
Cite please.
>and liberals saying we are having too many kids.
We are.
>Did they change their minds, now that they need more tax payers?
We don't.
lojbab >> Stay informed about: The Irresponsible Generation |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Feb 20, 2004 Posts: 4008
|
(Msg. 13) Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:44 pm
Post subject: Re: The Irresponsible Generation [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
|
|
|
cary RemoveThis @afone.as.arizona.edu (Cary Kittrell) wrote:
>But that's not the feeling I'm getting from the Usenet posts
>and the articles I had in mind. In these there seems to be an underlying
>feeling that it's just plain WRONG to choose not to have children,
>or even to choose to have only one or two. There's rather a
>lot of consternation out there arising from the fact that
>the mirage of the 50s-style nuclear family is no longer
>the automatic default option, and I suspect that this
>might be related to that.
And yet the Scandinavians seem to be happy.
lojbab >> Stay informed about: The Irresponsible Generation |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Feb 20, 2004 Posts: 4008
|
(Msg. 14) Posted: Wed Nov 28, 2007 11:53 pm
Post subject: Re: The Irresponsible Generation [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
|
|
|
Wide Eyed in Wonder <writingken.TakeThisOut@yahoo.com> wrote:
>On Nov 28, 12:34 pm, Bob LeChevalier <loj....TakeThisOut@lojban.org> wrote:
>> Wide Eyed in Wonder <writing....TakeThisOut@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> >Are you kidding?
>>
>> No.
>>
>> > He (or you) confirmed it to be absolutely true. The
>> >irresponsible generation is retiring into a system they didn't fix
>>
>> They didn't break it either.
>>
>> >and requiring their children to bail them out with higher taxes (on all
>> >other generations but their own).
>>
>> That the tax rate needs to be higher in order to maintain the
>> government services that "we the people" want is patently obvious to
>> anyone but a "tax cut and spend" Republican. The irresponsibility is
>> to cut taxes anyway. And the whole generation is not to be held
>> responsible for the idiocy of people like YOU.
>
>The Social Security system was known to be deficient before Reagan
>came to power, but that is irrelevant, since I said BOTH parties of
>this generation failed their kids and neither did anything to fix it.
>Further, since they knew it was coming, why didn't the Irresponsible
>Generation save money up in a saving account or investments for their
>expenses.
Why should they?
>You can keep spinning this all you want, but..in the end...it used to
>be that parents saved up an inheritance for their kids,
Myth. SOME parents did, and some still do. But far more often than
today, parents died before the kids reached adulthood, parents had so
many kids that their inheritance was split so many ways that it wasn't
worth much, and most of the time the savings lost ground against
inflation because it wasn't invested in anything that would gain in
value. And since there was no social security, when the parents lived
into old age, they drained their savings down to zippo rapidly,
whereupon the kids had to support them.
lojbab >> Stay informed about: The Irresponsible Generation |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
External

Since: Nov 25, 2007 Posts: 29
|
(Msg. 15) Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 6:09 am
Post subject: Re: The Irresponsible Generation [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: alt>education, others (more info?)
|
|
|
On Nov 28, 10:08 pm, Bob LeChevalier <loj....RemoveThis@lojban.org> wrote:
> Wide Eyed in Wonder <writing....RemoveThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >On Nov 28, 3:49 pm, Bob LeChevalier <loj....RemoveThis@lojban.org> wrote:
> >> Wide Eyed in Wonder <writing....RemoveThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >> >ALL of that to confirm that the Irresponsible Generation (both
> >> >parties) KNEW this problem was coming and did nothing to fix it (not
> >> >even in the Clinton era, since Clinton...too...borrowed from the
> >> >Social Security trust fund).
>
> >> There is nothing wrong with borrowing from the trust fund, so long as
> >> we pay it back.
>
> >REALLY? KNOWing you don't have enough (already) in the trust fund and
> >taking more from it, anway, is not wrong?
>
> Your statement doesn't make any sense. The trust fund isn't a pile of
> money somewhere. It is a paper (or more likely computerized)
> accounting of how much the social security administration holds in
> trust for the beneficiaries of social security.
>
> Money held in trust is always invested somewhere, which means that
> someone is "borrowing it". If that someone can be counted on to pay
> it back before the trust fund needs to fulfill its obligations, then
> the trust fund is properly working, and no one is "taking more from
> it", or indeed "taking" anything.
>
> It is when the government borrows money with no hope of paying it
> back, and no sense of obligation to pay it back that this "trust" is
> misplaced. But the social security administration doesn't have a lot
> of choice - the only things it can be legally invested in are part of
> the deficit financing.
>
> >You, yourself, prove my point, Bob.
>
> You have no point, turkey.
>
> lojbab
A person has a savings account for their retirement. They "borrow"
from the savings. Later, they had no money to retire on...whose fault
is it...their kids?
Kenneth Clifton
christiansuprehero.com >> Stay informed about: The Irresponsible Generation |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |  |
|
You can post new topics in this forum You can reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
|
|
|
 |
|
|