Zionist pressure group ADL offers solution to the "Decembe..

Jd <ZionsFire RemoveThis @att.net> wrote:
>Bob, in a state of lawlessness the Constitution itself is irrelevant is it not?

There is no state of lawlessness.

>Deny evolution

Why should I deny reality?

>or face the consequenses of anarchy.

Evolution has nothing to do with human governance. And if it did,
neither my nor anyone else's denial would have nothing to do with its
consequences.

lojbab
 >> Stay informed about: Zionist pressure group ADL offers solution to the "Decembe.. 

On Dec 6, 5:52 pm, Steve Hayes <hayesm... RemoveThis @hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Thu, 06 Dec 2007 16:16:31 -0500, tony cooper <tony_cooper... RemoveThis @earthlink.net>
> wrote:
>
> >On Thu, 6 Dec 2007 14:19:24 -0500, "Don Phillipson"
> ><d.phillipsonSPAMBL... RemoveThis @ncf.ca> wrote:
>
> >>If it is a real problem in the USA or elsewhere that "schools and
> >>local governments are confronted with . . . how to approach the
> >>holidays without favoring one religious faith over another," these
> >>administrative bodies might have the gumption to ask how
> >>other countries or cultures manage successfully.
>
> >How another country or culture handles a holiday without favoring one
> >religious faith over another is totally irrelevant to US school
> >administrators. They operate under US laws and need to concern
> >themselves only with avoiding being sued in US courts.
>
> In the US, as in most other countries, Christmas usually occurs in the school
> holidays, so it shouldn't be a problem. They can just ignore it and let the
> kids celebrate it at home if they want to.

Ignore Christmas? Things must be very different in S. A. Around here
Christmas is celebrated for a month before the day arrives. What
about the school chorus's Christmas concert? Teaching the kids
Christmas carols in music class? Making a Christmas picture in art
class? Decorating the classrooms? The special Christmas lunch the
last week before vacation? Teaching the kids the quaint Christmas
customs of other countries? ("In some places, Christmas happens in
summer! No, not July.")

Of course, I'm remembering my childhood. I don't think there are a
lot of music or art classes any more.

The solution to the Christmas concert (Laura, I hope you're not
reading this) has long been to have the little kids sing "S'vivon, sov
sov sov" and the big kids sing "Mah-oz tsur" or something. We did not
need Abe Foxman to suggest that.

It's not just school, by the way. My town has a Christmas display
complete with creche (I think) on the plaza. A lot of places couldn't
get away with that.

--
Jerry Friedman
 >> Stay informed about: Zionist pressure group ADL offers solution to the "Decembe.. 

On Thu, 06 Dec 2007 23:59:46 -0500, tony cooper <tony_cooper213.TakeThisOut@earthlink.net>
wrote:

>On Fri, 07 Dec 2007 06:57:14 +0200, Steve Hayes
><hayesmstw.TakeThisOut@hotmail.com> wrote:
>>No, I think the article is just silly, because the kids aren't IN school in
>>the holiday season, expet, perhaps, take the opportunity for doing necessary
>>maintenance and repairs.
>
>Sometimes, Steve, you cause me to shake my head in wonder. The
>Seminole County (FL) schools are closed for the "Winter Break" (can't
>call it Christmas Break) between December 24 and January 6.

Ah well, just in time for Old Christmas on January 7. Do they mind if kids who
observe that extend the holidays by an extra day? Then they can ignore that
too.



--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
Web: http://hayesfam.bravehost.com/stevesig.htm
Blog: http://methodius.blogspot.com
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk
 >> Stay informed about: Zionist pressure group ADL offers solution to the "Decembe.. 

Steve Hayes <hayesmstw DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote:

>On Thu, 06 Dec 2007 23:59:46 -0500, tony cooper <tony_cooper213 DeleteThis @earthlink.net>
>wrote:
>
>>On Fri, 07 Dec 2007 06:57:14 +0200, Steve Hayes
>><hayesmstw DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote:
>>>No, I think the article is just silly, because the kids aren't IN school in
>>>the holiday season, expet, perhaps, take the opportunity for doing necessary
>>>maintenance and repairs.
>>
>>Sometimes, Steve, you cause me to shake my head in wonder. The
>>Seminole County (FL) schools are closed for the "Winter Break" (can't
>>call it Christmas Break) between December 24 and January 6.
>
>Ah well, just in time for Old Christmas on January 7. Do they mind if kids who
>observe that extend the holidays by an extra day? Then they can ignore that
>too.

Winter break is not a religious observance and is not changed for
anyone's religious practices. The schools are closed for public
convenience - if they kept them open, absenteeism would be so high
among staff and students that nothing much would get done anyway.


There are US legal holidays on 25 December and 1 January, but they are
defined by the date, and not by what they celebrate. In years where
those dates fall on a Saturday or a Sunday, which are normally not
workdays, the legal holidays are the day before or the day after those
dates.

Likewise, spring break is not a religious observance, though most
school districts assign it to the week before Easter or the week after
Easter as a matter of public convenience (most colleges, however, time
their spring breaks entirely apart from when Easter is). But when
spring break is the week after Easter, then Good Friday is NOT a
holiday, despite it being as important as Easter in some religious
traditions.

lojbab
 >> Stay informed about: Zionist pressure group ADL offers solution to the "Decembe.. 

Bob LeChevalier <lojbab.RemoveThis@lojban.org> writes:

> "The holiday season" these days starts immediately after
> Thanksgiving (and would probably start earlier if Thanksgiving
> weren't in the way).

Of course, Chanukah doesn't necessarily wait that long. In 2013, it
will start the night before Thanksgiving.

I'm still getting catalogs and ads telling me there's plenty of time
to do my holiday shopping, and Chaunkah started Tuesday night.

--
Evan Kirshenbaum +------------------------------------
HP Laboratories |If I may digress momentarily from
1501 Page Mill Road, 1U, MS 1141 |the mainstream of this evening's
Palo Alto, CA 94304 |symposium, I'd like to sing a song
|which is completely pointless.
kirshenbaum.RemoveThis@hpl.hp.com | Tom Lehrer
(650)857-7572

http://www.kirshenbaum.net/
 >> Stay informed about: Zionist pressure group ADL offers solution to the "Decembe.. 

On Dec 7, 6:26 pm, Steve Hayes <hayesm... DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote:
> On Fri, 7 Dec 2007 10:23:45 -0800 (PST), "jerry_fried...@yahoo.com"
>
>
>
> <jerry_fried... DeleteThis @yahoo.com> wrote:
> >On Dec 6, 5:52 pm, Steve Hayes <hayesm... DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote:
> >> On Thu, 06 Dec 2007 16:16:31 -0500, tony cooper <tony_cooper... DeleteThis @earthlink.net>
> >> wrote:
> >> In the US, as in most other countries, Christmas usually occurs in the school
> >> holidays, so it shouldn't be a problem. They can just ignore it and let the
> >> kids celebrate it at home if they want to.
>
> >Ignore Christmas? Things must be very different in S. A. Around here
> >Christmas is celebrated for a month before the day arrives. What
> >about the school chorus's Christmas concert? Teaching the kids
> >Christmas carols in music class? Making a Christmas picture in art
> >class? Decorating the classrooms? The special Christmas lunch the
> >last week before vacation? Teaching the kids the quaint Christmas
> >customs of other countries? ("In some places, Christmas happens in
> >summer! No, not July.")
>
> But ther don't NEED to do that, Shirley?

I don't think they need to, but they seem to think so.

I don't think I read your post carefully enough. You seem to be
talking about what the schools should do and what they need to do. I
replied with what they actually do. If I'd understood you correctly,
I would have provided a whole different rant.

> Do they (in the USA) celebrate 4 July on 4 June, if 4 July falls in the school
> holidays?

That's different. July 4 is celebrated only on July 4 (except for
firecrackers). Christmas is celebrated for the month ending on
Christmas. Maybe you could think of it as Advent.

--
Jerry Friedman
 >> Stay informed about: Zionist pressure group ADL offers solution to the "Decembe.. 

On 07/12/07 14:45, Bob LeChevalier wrote:
> "Don Phillipson" <d.phillipsonSPAMBLOCK RemoveThis @ncf.ca> wrote:
>> Well, it is no particular business of non-Americans how American
>> institutions interpret the American constitution, but it seems very
>> peculiar that a law forbidding the establishment of religion is
>> now so interpreted that the state "cannot favor any denomination or
>> religion over another."
>
> "the DEFINITION of "establishment" is government favoring some flavor
> of organized religion with law or money (which in the US necessarily
> means law).
>
Presumably it doesn't include having mottoes like "In one or more gods
some of us trust."

To be fair, I must admit that my own country is a little hypocritical on
this issue. I think we still have the tradition of a prayer at the
opening of a new parliamentary session. One of these days I should check
which god the prayer is addressed to.

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
For an e-mail address, see my web page.
 >> Stay informed about: Zionist pressure group ADL offers solution to the "Decembe.. 

On Fri, 7 Dec 2007 10:23:45 -0800 (PST), "jerry_friedman@yahoo.com"
<jerry_friedman.TakeThisOut@yahoo.com> wrote:

>On Dec 6, 5:52 pm, Steve Hayes <hayesm....TakeThisOut@hotmail.com> wrote:
>> On Thu, 06 Dec 2007 16:16:31 -0500, tony cooper <tony_cooper....TakeThisOut@earthlink.net>
>> wrote:
>> In the US, as in most other countries, Christmas usually occurs in the school
>> holidays, so it shouldn't be a problem. They can just ignore it and let the
>> kids celebrate it at home if they want to.
>
>Ignore Christmas? Things must be very different in S. A. Around here
>Christmas is celebrated for a month before the day arrives. What
>about the school chorus's Christmas concert? Teaching the kids
>Christmas carols in music class? Making a Christmas picture in art
>class? Decorating the classrooms? The special Christmas lunch the
>last week before vacation? Teaching the kids the quaint Christmas
>customs of other countries? ("In some places, Christmas happens in
>summer! No, not July.")

But ther don't NEED to do that, Shirley?

Do they (in the USA) celebrate 4 July on 4 June, if 4 July falls in the school
holidays?


--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
Web: http://hayesfam.bravehost.com/stevesig.htm
Blog: http://methodius.blogspot.com
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk
 >> Stay informed about: Zionist pressure group ADL offers solution to the "Decembe.. 

On 08/12/07 09:52, Evan Kirshenbaum wrote:
> Bob LeChevalier <lojbab RemoveThis @lojban.org> writes:
>
>> "The holiday season" these days starts immediately after
>> Thanksgiving (and would probably start earlier if Thanksgiving
>> weren't in the way).
>
> Of course, Chanukah doesn't necessarily wait that long. In 2013, it
> will start the night before Thanksgiving.
>
> I'm still getting catalogs and ads telling me there's plenty of time
> to do my holiday shopping, and Chaunkah started Tuesday night.
>

Already bought the ham, then?

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20071206/od_afp/usjewsholidayoffbeat_07120...5544;_y

NEW YORK (AFP) - A posh food store in New York's Greenwich Village has
found itself red faced after offering hams for sale with the slogan
"Delicious for Hanukkah," the current Jewish religious holiday.

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
For an e-mail address, see my web page.
 >> Stay informed about: Zionist pressure group ADL offers solution to the "Decembe.. 

On Fri, 07 Dec 2007 22:39:13 +1100, Peter Moylan
<peter DeleteThis @DIESPAMMERSDIEpmoylan.org> wrote:

>On 07/12/07 14:45, Bob LeChevalier wrote:
>> "Don Phillipson" <d.phillipsonSPAMBLOCK DeleteThis @ncf.ca> wrote:
>>> Well, it is no particular business of non-Americans how American
>>> institutions interpret the American constitution, but it seems very
>>> peculiar that a law forbidding the establishment of religion is
>>> now so interpreted that the state "cannot favor any denomination or
>>> religion over another."
>>
>> "the DEFINITION of "establishment" is government favoring some flavor
>> of organized religion with law or money (which in the US necessarily
>> means law).
>>
>Presumably it doesn't include having mottoes like "In one or more gods
>some of us trust."
>
>To be fair, I must admit that my own country is a little hypocritical on
>this issue. I think we still have the tradition of a prayer at the
>opening of a new parliamentary session. One of these days I should check
>which god the prayer is addressed to.

Every daily meeting of the UK House of Commons starts with a prayer by
the Speaker's Chaplain. The members kneel on the benches, facing
backwards, with their bums in the air. For the avoidance of unseemly
hilarity, this rite is conducted in secret - the public gallery is not
opened until it is over, and it is never broadcast. A suprising number
of members attend, mainly because it is the best way of ensuring you
get a seat.

--
Don Aitken
Mail to the From: address is not read.
To email me, substitute "clara.co.uk" for "freeuk.com"
 >> Stay informed about: Zionist pressure group ADL offers solution to the "Decembe.. 

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 >> Stay informed about: Zionist pressure group ADL offers solution to the "Decembe.. 

On Sun, 09 Dec 2007 00:35:46 GMT, "The Grammer Genious" <waupecong RemoveThis @yahoo.com>
wrote:

>Except sometimes it's the work of the the atheists and the secular humanists
>that hate America and its Christmas values.

As Tom Lehrer says, Christmas, with its spirit of giving, gives us all a
chance to reflect on what we most deeply and sincerely belive in. I refer, of
course, to money.


--
Steve Hayes from Tshwane, South Africa
Web: http://hayesfam.bravehost.com/stevesig.htm
Blog: http://methodius.blogspot.com
E-mail - see web page, or parse: shayes at dunelm full stop org full stop uk
 >> Stay informed about: Zionist pressure group ADL offers solution to the "Decembe..